Diarrhoea in elderly piggy

madkatherine

Post   » Mon May 01, 2023 10:27 am


Hi guys!
I would like to get your opinion on the situation with my elderly pig Falafel. Sorry in advance for the long thread.

Piggy info
Boar
5.5-6 years old
Diet: unlimited hay and water, veggies, versele Laga cavia complete pellets

Backstory:
About a year and a half ago Falafel lost his cage mate. He immediately went into what I can only describe as a depression: he was barely interested in food or water, became less active, his pops started being drop-shaped, etc. :( Back then we helped him with some probiotic, additional vit c, oxbow digestive support and eventually getting him a new, younger cage mate. His digestion and general health became better but he's been getting oxbow digestive cookies every other day since then. In general, he was back to his normal active gentle self.

Current problem:
About 2 weeks ago I noticed that there was something wrong with him: not interested in food again, pretty lethargic, puffed up, barely pooping. He lost weight. I started with probiotics and critical care immediately and rushed to the vet.

The vet started some meds against dehydration, vit c, electrolytes and antibiotic. He was also given espumisan at some point. His cytology was ok. I continued critical care and probiotics alongside antibiotics. He started improving but then, after about 6 days, he became wobbly and couldn't use his hind legs... We rushed to get vet again, I was a mess so I don't really remember what they gave him.... The next day he was better. I'm still not sure what that was.

I had a theory that he developed teeth issues which was originally confirmed by one vet and a surgery was recommended, but then another vet said to wait for about a week and only do the surgery of there is no improvement. As Falafel started eating hay by himself they believed the teeth should be fine. Eventually they decided against the surgery.

And then started a real rollercoaster. One day he would be totally fine, the next day he would have diarrhea... And today he started crying when pooping :( and had diarrhea in the morning again. Now the poops are a bit mushy (and often greenish) but not runny.

I started reading about the antibiotic we were given and I wish I did it earlier. It was Enrofloxacin, we had Enroxil but this is the same ingredient as in Baytril. He would be given 1/4 of an Enroxil 50mg tab twice a day. I read that it indeed may cause diarrhea and is generally controversial. So I'm stopping giving it to him (and I believe 2 weeks of antibiotics is enough).

We have a vet appointment at another clinic on Wednesday (today is Monday) as I want a second opinion about his GI and teeth and also check for bladder stones.

In the meantime, I'm continuing probiotics, a little bit of critical care (a thick, not watery mix that he eats by himself) for extra nutrients and to stimulate his appetite and stopping all the veg at least until the vet visit - does that sound ok to you guys?

Besides crying when pooping, he is generally active (for an old pig), interested in food (tho very salty that I'm not giving him pea flakes), drinks by himself.

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Lynx
Celebrate!!!

Post   » Mon May 01, 2023 11:29 am


Are you currently giving the Oxbow digestive support? I ask because there was a recent incident where it caused problems. Discontinue it immediately if you are giving it. There may be a "batch" issue (since you successfully gave it for a while).

Start reading here:
https://www.guinealynx.info/forums/view ... 3#p2325573

p.s. if you want to be thorough, it might also be worthwhile getting an xray to check for stones (can cause a variety of signs) and other potential issues.

I imagine you have read this?
https://www.guinealynx.info/diarrhea.html

madkatherine

Post   » Mon May 01, 2023 11:32 am


Omg I am giving it. Thank you so much for letting me know, discontinuing right away!

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Lynx
Celebrate!!!

Post   » Mon May 01, 2023 11:35 am


( I edited my post above to add more info )

madkatherine

Post   » Mon May 01, 2023 11:36 am


Yes yes, I read the page and it helped me a lot - thank you so much, it's very thorough!
But I am paranoid and at a loss so decided to post the full story/situation to see if I could get some more insights.

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Lynx
Celebrate!!!

Post   » Mon May 01, 2023 12:09 pm


He would be given 1/4 of an Enroxil 50mg tab twice a day. This might be on the high end, though there is a range of dosages for enrofloxacin. How much does he weigh? You can check the dosage on this page if you have his weight. I would use "1cc" as the suspension (though it's a pill) and 50mg as the amount in the suspension.
https://www.guinealynx.info/calculate_dose.html

The old guidelines on the antibiotics page are Oral Dosage: 2.5-10.0 mg/kg q12h so depending on his weight, it might be on the high end.

The diarrhea, as new, seems to be related to the antibiotic.

Are you weighing daily right now? Very important for seeing how he's doing.

madkatherine

Post   » Mon May 01, 2023 12:24 pm


Pre-illness he was around 1090 g.
When he got sick, it fell to 850 (obviously I almost had my heart stop). Then it would fluctuate between 870-900g once we started the treatment + critical care every 2ish hours.
Now he's losing weight again. I just weighted him - 790g 😭

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Lynx
Celebrate!!!

Post   » Mon May 01, 2023 12:36 pm


I hope it's as simple as stopping the digestive tabs and perhaps the enrofloxacin.

I used the calculator and used a dose of .25 cc, a suspension of 50mg/cc, and a weight of .79kg. This yields a single dosage of 15mg/kg which is pretty high for his weight. Assuming you do stop using it (always best to consult with your vet, describe worsening signs), the diarrhea should let up.

When any antibiotic is given, it is best to identify the bacteria that is causing the problem. Not always possible.

madkatherine

Post   » Mon May 01, 2023 12:54 pm


Thank you!
I am stopping the digestive support and antibiotics, still keeping a close eye on his poops and weight. I will probably also up his critical care a bit. And will stop veg for a day or two.

I will ask the new vet if we could do a stool culture test and x-ray too.

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Lynx
Celebrate!!!

Post   » Mon May 01, 2023 1:33 pm


Unsure a stool culture test would be productive. If something like coccidia (if I remember correctly), it is hit or miss if you find the issue.

Let the vet know asap about discontinuing the antibiotics. It is important to make any antibiotic treatment changes under the supervision of a vet (I do not have a medical background).

I would think it would be best to see what happens after discontinuing the tabs and antibiotics before taking an xray.

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Lynx
Celebrate!!!

Post   » Mon May 01, 2023 1:39 pm


Also, if the diarrhea is primarily caused by the antibiotic, it would seem a stool culture (which is a check for parasites) might not provide any useful information.

madkatherine

Post   » Wed May 03, 2023 12:21 pm


Update on Falafel

On Sunday, Apr 30th, midday I gave the last dose of antibiotics.
On Monday, May 1st, I gave digestive support in the morning and, after learning about the recent case with it, decided to discontinue it.
I discontinued veggies since Mon morning as well.

I continued giving probiotics, a little bit of critical care and vit c cookies.

The improvement was almost instant! On Tue his poops were the best I saw in weeks 🥹🥹 still not large, but good shape and color and not mushy.

He became way more active and interested in food.

Honestly, knock on wood.

Today at the vet's, they confirmed the teeth are good. They did feel a bit if gas so hell be getting belly massages twice a day (if you have tips pls let me know). We will try to collect his urine for a test.

I just gave him a little bit of parsley now and, if all good, we'll add a bit if veg day on day.

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